Spending a considerable amount of time cross-country in the backcountry, it was inevitable at some point I would get lost. Tis why I carry a handy topo map and compass.
If you are familiar with maps and finding your bearings, it takes three points of reference and a preferably a compass to triangulate your position.
Using GPS it takes three measurements from the satellites to your receiver to identify where you are located—a fourth measure can pin it down to a foot or two.
Religion is no different and having only one point of reference, you are in fact, lost—
Having two points of reference can get you in the ballpark (near the warning track) while having three points you’ll know exactly where you stand. It is in fact a necessity it every point of reason. Another option—stick with any one belief point on the globe which is always seems like the center, but is nowhere at the same time—like being born into the only thing you know.
Culture can be illustrated in the same way. When the untraveled declare their home to be the best place on earth, it is obvious to the well traveled it isn’t. Being exposed to multiple facets of humanity one starts to realize his own insignificance when that point of reference is unheard of to the rest of the world—and they are just fine not knowing you or your beliefs even exist.
Without another point of reference there is no way whatsoever to know where you are, while at the same time KNOW, that your religion is the right one. Sincerely Yours, The Faith Trap
The less one knows the more sure one can be of his position.
TheCommonAtheist 
When I was in Boy Scouts learning orienteering they were so stingy they made us triangulate our positions with only two points of reference and a compass.
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Must be why Christians have a Father, Son and Holy Ghost.
They should contact someone from my old Scout troop. We’ll show them how to triangulate with only two points of reference and they can lay off a redundant member of their Trinity. That’d mean a 33% reduction in what they have to put in collection plates on Sunday.
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Does that work for pro-science people too? Most of them have only one reference point as well.
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I think if your science is influenced by the pulpit it works. Science is good at making things and inventing little shiny things, but it isn’t really very good at describing human consciousness. Cognitive science? Really psychology is more an art form and a very young one. Mixing that field with real science is a misnomer.
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So, now we have two reference points, science and religion. Is human consciousness well enough understood to be a third reference point? Not right now, I would endeavour to say. Yes we have 5000 or more yesrs of Eastern philosophy, which has made some amazing discoveries about consciousness, but it is too often tinged with its own form of religion, too many restrictive forms and tenets and rituals, at least for me. I like the “Do It Yourself Your Own Way” method. Anyone can follow those “instructions,” lol.
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Just by-the-bye, I personally do not agree with the first two reference pointsI gave above. Neither of them are trustworthy enough to be solid guidelines.
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Or meaning, beauty, value, morality, art …
But if you like toys that go ping, zap, woosh or bang then science is definitely your man.
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Fun fact: Triangulation was introduced into Europe by Muslim cartographers.
Islamic cartography got a leg-up from having to know how to calculate prayer times and the direction to Mecca, necessitating the development of more accurate astrolabes. That resulted in sophisticated mapping and navigation methods which in turn gave a boost to sea trading and early ocean exploration.
The Ancient Greeks used triangulation in geometry and the Egyptians in architecture but no-one applied it to surveying and cartography before Abu Rayhan Biruni in the 11th century.
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But if the earth is flat, aren’t triangles and circles a myth? 😃
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I can see you from 5000 miles away, I just have to look through the 62km of curvature that doesn’t exist
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See the shadow outside your window?
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You and Mike need to find a legal hobby…
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why if? the earth is flat. just look carefully, you will see a light beam from yours truly
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I do!!!
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I lit it by hitting two stones against each other. I know it must look like laser technology
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You win this round, but I’ll be back!
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That’s all the science and technology we need.
Fire and wheels and agriculture are just fancy stuff for pretentious yuppies.
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the earth is flat.
No way. If the earth was flat I wouldn’t keep missing pool shots. It’s definitely slanted.
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Check the floor, man, it must be the floor. The earth is flat
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I can assure you I check the floor very thoroughly. Usually just after it begins whirling following my third pool game and 10th-12th beer.
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Now that explains. I hear a number of beers can alter the plane of the earth. At some point, there are valleys everywhere
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Indeed. It also provides irrefutable evidence the world rotates. Around me.
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Without a doubt at all. Again if one wants evidence they shouldn’t believe everything they see, a couple of beers does the trick. You start seeing twice as many things
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Also women become four times as beautiful. Twice as much for each copy.
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And the confidence one gains. Nothing is impossible
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Except communication.
Beer can also alter the way the atmosphere transmits sound waves, so that your words of wisdom and irresistible seduction can be transformed into stupid, offensive gibberish while transiting from your mouth to her ears.
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That’s a point you got there.
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Interesting, I use a triangulation method to find astronomical objects with a telescope. Using a star chart, I see the objects location within a constellation. Then I eyeball that area of sky over, study it compared to the map to get a general idea where my object lies. I find a couple of stars that will form a triangle with the rough location of the object I’m looking for, the objects hopeful location being one of the points on the triangle. I then use that mental image of this triangle to point my telescope, usually, very close to the object I’m hunting.
I’ve gotten pretty good at it.
There are computerized mounts that do the hunting for you, but it detracts from the experience IMO.
Around here, if I’m out in the woods, I can usually figure out which way to go just using the sun. It’s pretty easy to figure out N,S,E,W, with only that information. Plus I have a pretty good map in my head about things here close to home, I generally know how to find my way. I know which highways and roads head which way, have a pretty good idea where I’m at on that map in my head, and how to use the sun to head in a direction I want to go. I might be off a little from where I thought I was, but it’s good enough to get me out of the woods.
At night I know the constellations well enough to use them to guide me. All bets are off if it’s clouded up though… Time to build a fire I guess, or use the cell phone. 😉
The one place I do have a compass, is in my boat.
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reality needs no reference points 😁😃🤣
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Let’s say that’s true. If that’s all you know how can you know it without not knowing it? Isn’t that a reference point?
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hmm.. what else is there besides reality?? i’ll tell you what. Imagination. imagination uses reference points.
take for example how we expereince the sun coming up and going down. but from the sun’s perspective, it never comes and goes anywhere. so our perspective is illusory, it is not reality.
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Exactly! Confusing perception with reality certainly is a very narrow bandwidth to consider that, “the real world”.
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